Omen of Amelioration and XP loss threads.

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SpankyKong#9805 が発言:

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DarKWolF90#6544 が発言:

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SpankyKong#9805 が発言:

They can't comprehend that I would enjoy the gameplay while despising one aspect of the punishment design.

Your individual enjoyment is not more important than everything that's been stated here as reasons why XP penalty exists. The core of the game is far more important.



If you enjoy the gameplay enough, then you can be bothered to learn how to deal and overcome the punishment. If you can't be bothered, then you don't enjoy the gameplay that much and you're not the target audience.



What's more important? A functional ladder system with a proper challenge that most players will spend hundreds of hours on? Or the frustration of a handful of players that can't be bothered to learn the game and will play less than 50hs without even buying a stash tab?

"Most players" stopped playing the game. Elevating XP loss as the core of the game is laughable - the numbers don't bear out that it retains "most players" & it never has.

Same decline as 0.1 which is perfectly normal for EA.

The main complaints from the players and content creators that carry the game, and that explain player loss, is mainly lack of build diversity and lack of content. The target audience has mainly covered all the game has to offer already and none of those is actually complaining about xp loss. (because they've already overcome that)

bringing "player decline" as an argument misses the point entirely without context.

And yes, XP loss is a core part of the game and it's ladder system. It's not up for debate that's literally a by-design choice.

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Direfell#7544 が発言:

Thats the games way of saying "find a way to die less often"

This is lifeless game style - every step you watch what you are doing.
it means one lvl can take weeks....BORING GAMING!!!
...I do not mention annoying Critical Kills Damage from random mobs/boss or offside screen

game is broken and right now is only for fanatics or people without life.

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DarKWolF90#6544 が発言:

If you die every 1-3hs past lvl 95 your build is *********

Your response seems to come from a fanatical perspective or a person lacking real-life experience.

I represent ordinary people who want to enjoy the game rather than feel frustrated.

By the way

My gear before patch 0.2 was exceptionally good; however, the gameplay beyond level 96 became frustrating, nonsensical, and unchallenging.

I won't even discuss the situation after patch 0.2; the number of players who have stopped or left the game speaks for itself...

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DarkDredd#2184 が発言:

This is lifeless game style - every step you watch what you are doing.
it means one lvl can take weeks....BORING GAMING!!!
...I do not mention annoying Critical Kills Damage from random mobs/boss or offside screen

game is broken and right now is only for fanatics or people without life.

Ya, poe has always catered to that demographic and its part of why poe1 is so beloved by its supporters.

Its perfectly fine to be annoyed by its systems. Level 100 is quite literally a milestone that most players will never reach and if you start playing with that as a primary goal it feels like shit to have frequent setbacks. I felt the same on my first poe1 character.

But I do believe the death tax is good for the game in the long run, and I much prefer it over having gear 'break' and require repairing. Without pressure to build defensive layers / play tactically build diversity suffers.

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Nyon#6673 が発言:

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DarKWolF90#6544 が発言:

Geniunely curious if people are complaining of XP loss regardless of the existence of Omens of Amelioration, which are currently going for 8-12ex consistently and are fairly easy to farm in Ritual.


I've literally not suffered XP loss at all by always carrying one of these past 10% xp.

Pushing 95+ is not hard at all with this. You get way more per map than the cost of omens, even if not juicing.


Am I missing something? Do people not know about these? Do they think they're more expensive/rare than they currently are?

Most threads complain about "10% exp loss" and I'm like "bro it doesn't have to be 10% you're pushing high 90s and your next upgrade probably costs 20div why the F aren't you stocking up on omens when they're low?"


I simply don't get it, the game offers you the solution, the solution works, even in SSF now that they're really common. What gives?

Theres probably several reasons for this.

One of them is that the majority of people who complain about this are the people who are litterally dying nonstop, like multiple times per map.
And if your dying at that rate then buying a omen that costs 6 chaos (or whatever it is now) per death becomes very expensive.

Their problem is that instead of realising that their bad at the game and trying to improve their gameplay or build they think its easier to just go on a forum and complain.

A secondary reason is that there is a portion of the playerbase that find this game too challenging but their ego wont allow them to simply complain that its too hard so they need to find some excuse to hide behind, like the fact that exp loss is somehow hindering their progress and stupid imaginary stuff like "random unavoidable one shots".

How many of you in t15 and at that level don't run energy shield. Saying ppl are bad at the game bc the balance is out of whack is pretty petty. The devs said all damage but purple is physical and armour is suppose to be the best at mitigating physical damage yet most ppl don't use it bc it's considered bad and only use energy shield bc it scales higher and makes tanking hits easier. Saying someone is bad at a game when everyone grinding is only doing it one way with like 4 to 5 skills is kinda pathetic. There is no skill in doing what someone else tells you to in a build guide

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DarKWolF90#6544 が発言:

Same decline as 0.1 which is perfectly normal for EA.

The main complaints from the players and content creators that carry the game, and that explain player loss, is mainly lack of build diversity and lack of content. The target audience has mainly covered all the game has to offer already and none of those is actually complaining about xp loss. (because they've already overcome that)

bringing "player decline" as an argument misses the point entirely without context.

And yes, XP loss is a core part of the game and it's ladder system. It's not up for debate that's literally a by-design choice.

It's not though. The rate of decay for 0.2 is significantly faster. I'd have to do the actual math. However, just from visual graphs alone you can see it. 0.1 declined from 600k to 200k active players over months and declined from there to ~40k over an even longer period. 0.2 declined from 200k to ~40k over a single month.


Also as someone who quit with roughly 15 other friends i didn't quit because of no content i quit because the gameplay gatcha loop of gearing/leveling your characters is actively worse than sawing off my own leg over a period of weeks. All of us had fun in 0.1 because the grind was fun. It's not anymore.

The xp loss has three side effects:

Encourage people to quit once they hit the wall. Yes, maybe it is not the best design, maybe they were experimenting and try something new. But what they expect to do? Quit or start a new one. There is less creativity and less diversity.

These ladder thing is a niche that represent few players who lossing xp is not a issue with they optimized characters. So, they already have beaten the game or probably they copied from their favorite youtube channel. The oppinion for the rest of 98% casual players is what matters.

Great rewards comes with great risk. The xp loss is just too much punishing at some point and encourages to avoid challenging content. Go grind your ladder in low level maps and press ESC and exit at the first trouble.

What you mean people don't understand that reaching level 100 is not a goal? The use of xp is in all games a reward for playing the game. Loosing that progress is punishing the player for playing the game. It doesn't matter if one level up or down may not make much difference. What it is important is what players perceive.

There are too much games out there and players are not as patient as as two decades ago. There is a difference between loosing all progress and slow you down. The first creates frustration, the second challenge.

Because dying is a problem, developers have a hard time balancing the game. They can create content that is too hard, but players won't complain as much is does not cause a progress block.

There are a lot of alternatives of this outdated system used in other games. like xp debt and cap the lost to 20% of the current xp. In this system you never loose xp, it creates a debt and dying several times in a row because there is a difficult enemy is not a issue.

The only reason xp loss is being kept because of friction, but fundamentally its all about the game being design and tailored around trade.

How tf trade is related at all with xp loss ? Cause your progression is tied with trading, your progression is influenced by the market, your progression is dictated by randomization and itemization, your "loss" is one of the major incentive that makes you interact with the market.

Most of action RPG games or even any games in general that doesn't have the same fundamental design of tailoring and designing the game around trade don't have this kind of friction and loss. Being dead / failing a fight is already a loss. The game is designed to be expected to be played for a full 3 months for slowpokes and casuals, but experienced players can already beat the game fully within 1 to 2 weeks, and those that play the game for the living / able to afford playing the game everyday for 8 hours can easily beat and dominate the game within 1 week. The friction is there to make engagement longer, to make players play longer, and this kind of friction is expected when there aren't that many contents to make players engaged with the game longer.

XP loss is a self-made "problem" that created by GGG, then introduce the solution with omens or just generally a META archetype, to make players engaged longer, play longer, and have more exposure to the MTX shop.

In a vacuum, losing experience while also losing 1 revive in a content that you already invest your resources into is a very dumb game design. But in an online, live-service game where player counts and engagement are integral part in its design, its a needed factor. Don't blame GGG for it, blame yourself that you just accept this kind of system and still playing it, or playing a suboptimal / bad / inefficient build. PoE 2 is not even a remotely hard game, its an easy game, all you need to do is play the correct build.

im level 97 pushing to 100

20% = 5 days grinding maps with min 30% exp buff* gain per map.

i dont die often but even 2.5% puts me back a lot.

minion build which is slower, about 6hrs of play time per day.

Play as you like, why people care if it is removed is beyond me since it doesnt effect the players that like it at all (how?) seems like trying to gate keep high levels.

Will i continue to play if they dont remove, sure, of course, but im empathetic enough to understand some people dont have the 6hrs+ to play per day and therefore feel they will never make progress each time they die and will go somewhere else to feel good about having a high level character.

I dont see level as very important when it comes to game play, people are not wrong, but to old MMO players like myself getting max is the primary goal on every game that has a max level.

im 630hrs with same char, i expect level 100 around 800+ hrs.

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SpankyKong#9805 が発言:

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Nyon#6673 が発言:

Its not mandatory.
I dont use it.

A) Because I rarely die

B) Because im past level 90 so i dont really care about levels anymore

If you don't care about levels, then you would not stop playing if you reached level 100... correct?

I got to level 97, and XP loss was never a problem. I died so rarely — xp penalty made the game more interesting by rewarding smart, careful play.

And i didn’t stop playing but gave up to get 98 - the grind became pure tedium. You need to run something like 600 T18 maps with XP affixes and juiced towers because area levels are hard-capped at 82. That the real issue.

Let’s be honest: the people whining about XP loss are the same ones raised on games that hand out trophies for logging in.

This thread can be closed with "git gud" comment. If the xp loss is issue for you - just stop dying.

P.S Funny how the community is split between “We want more hardcore!” and “XP loss is ruining the game!”
Pick one, guys — you can’t demand challenge and then cry when there are consequences.